Conductor562 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 A compact with higher rpm and bpm then the Fuel... The Dewalt is a little short on in lbs and that's it...For starters, Hammer Drills are measured in Ft. Lbs. not In. Lbs.Secondly, the difference in a couple thousand RPM's is almost useless. You only need a drill to be so fast. The 3rd gear on the Dewalt is intended for driver application. Next to no one is using a drill over an impact for driving anyway. I'll take the extra torque over the RPM's any day. Even in hardwood you don't need 1/3 of the drills full torque, drill 1/4" or 3/8" steel or run a hole saw through a steel door and tell me you can't use that torque. I bought my dad the Dewalt compact a year or 2 ago. It's a nice drill in wood or drywall, but it's not cut out for metal at all and it's not exactly shinning in concrete. Wave the Dewalt flag until your arms fall off if you want, but to say the compact Dewalt is even in the same ballpark as the Milwaukee Fuel is preposterous. If Dewalt's premium drill had equal or greater torque compared to the Fuel they'd have it plastered everywhere, not hiding behind the UWO bullshit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firefighter4187 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 For starters, Hammer Drills are measured in Ft. Lbs. not In. Lbs.Secondly, the difference in a couple thousand RPM's is almost useless. You only need a drill to be so fast. The 3rd gear on the Dewalt is intended for driver application. Next to no one is using a drill over an impact for driving anyway. I'll take the extra torque over the RPM's any day. Even in hardwood you don't need 1/3 of the drills full torque, drill 1/4" or 3/8" steel or run a hole saw through a steel door and tell me you can't use that torque. I bought my dad the Dewalt compact a year or 2 ago. It's a nice drill in wood or drywall, but it's not cut out for metal at all and it's not exactly shinning in concrete. Wave the Dewalt flag until your arms fall off if you want, but to say the compact Dewalt is even in the same ballpark as the Milwaukee Fuel is preposterous. If Dewalt's premium drill had equal or greater torque compared to the Fuel they'd have it plastered everywhere, not hiding behind the UWO bullshit. Thank you, they know they have a less powerful drill, uwo is there hiding place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firefighter4187 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 There power tools don't really have any more special features then Dewalt's... All have LED lights, with Dewalt's in a nicer spot with no shadow... Both have high capacity 2 and 4 ah batteries, brushless motors, belt clips, metal ratcheting chucks, 1/2 chucks, high impact plastic cases, etc... Nothing really innovative there, all the competition has or is making the same thing The only innovative thing is they are releasing more tools with brushless motors...and like I said before, unless your a hardcore tool junkie, there is no need to upgrade your current brushed tools, that or a professional contractor making their living and even then most pro contractors I see still run old dewalt 18v tools run em till they die and buy a new one, Their not all out there looking for brushless tools to make sure they have the best everyday...Most here just seem like tool junkie's that use them are DIY and homeowners The hand tool line, Dewalt and most every large hand tool company makes tools equal to or better then milwaukee... All make utility knifes, screwdrivers, door lock installation kits, measuring tapes and list goes on... They all have their positive and negative attributes...Pliers, I'm gonna run channellock, screwdrivers I run canadian tire brand maximum and hard to find a better one for the price anywhere... Measuring tapes well there are so many to choose from I have mastercraft, stanley power lock (probably the most durable, most used one in existence), Lufkin... etc Snips, I have Wiss and that's it... Vise grips by Irwin... Most hand tools already have a company that has perfected them long ago and buying anything else your buying a lesser tool Milwaukee has a huge 12v line but unless you want 12v tools well it doesn't really matter then, because it's not like you can use the batteries in ur 18v line Who was the first one with with battery fuel gauges?, who was the first of the top tool manufactures to have brushless motors? Whos tool actually has side overmolding that actually works to protect the surface when laying down a drill? oh thats right, Milwaukee. DeWalt are a bunch of followers, For example, Milwaukee released the power source a couple of months back, DeWalt just released theres, it looks about Identical to Milwaukee, except for 2 usbs, which will drain the battery quicker. Milwaukee is not afraid of trying new things, they know in the long run, that will bring them ahead, and I dont see any cordless grease guns, caulkers, force logic tools, propex tools, ocilating tools, band saws etc. in DeWalts 20v line, Do you? DeWalt needs to get out from the under stump, period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conductor562 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 In a continuance of my rebuttal.....To assume the OP can get by with a little compact drill is highly speculative based on the information we have.We know he plans on working with concrete. Here the compact is not the ideal choice.We know he plans on doing automotive restoration work. Here the compact is sufficient.We know he has a farm. This is where the high speculation comes into play. I grew up on and around farms. Farms can range anywhere from a handful of acres to thousands of acres. Many farm applications are demanding and require a lot of capable equipment. Some farms can suffice with a 23 HP compact tractor like mine, but some require quarter million dollar machines. Even on small farms the tasks at hand can be demanding. I assume the OP has a small farm but even so, plugging a 1/2" hole in your drawbar would likely be impossible or at the least, very hard.Whether the OP decides to go with Milwaukee or Dewalt, I suggest the bigger model. It's ALWAYS better to have a little more than you need, it's NEVER fun to not have enough. Both make nice tools and either will likely serve him well. That being said, go into a heavy fab shop or industrial environment and see which color their tools are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firefighter4187 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I would much rather have a drill that does 99% of tasks, than 93%. I dont know about you but, I want something with more brute power, then a couple hundred more rpms... and dont start with UWO, DeWalt is FANTASTIC at marketing tools. My favorite marketing strategy from them is the tests on youtube, Unfortunetly, us "tool junkies" are smarter than they think we are, and can spot the competitors charger not plugged in...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I heard different things on uwo from Milwaukee guys saying Dewalt is hiding to actual math guys saying it's a more accurate way to measure a power tools total output power at the chuck so you guys can believe what you want it I'll still sleep tonight.... IChase don't give me the excuse this company is copying this company... Everyone copies EVERYBODY it's just big business... Dewalt power source with 2 usb's just offers people a way to charge 2 things at once not just to drain the battery faster, you should know better then that, it's called choice I'd love to be able to charge a phone plus a tablet out on the job site... The Milwaukee it's one or the other Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Also I want toy see the video of Dewalt with the charger unplugged... And it's not just Dewalt good at marketing... Milwaukee would be dead to if they didn't have a good marketing dept Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 We have a heavy fabrication shop here at work that designs and builds things for the plant and there's no Milwaukee here... Lots of yellow and other brands though, some makita, hilti Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I also believe makita was the first with brushless motors not Milwaukee... Plus when Dewalt was at the top where they still are Milwaukee copied Dewalt for years... Everyone does the same thing... If nobody copied anyone we'd have nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PedroHizzo Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I was on my phone most of the day and didnt really have the time for a full reply. There were multiple reasons why I personally switched from Dewalt to Milwaukee. I mainly switched due to the lack of certain tools that I wanted (Cordless Multi-tool, rotary tool, power pack). I use a mix of 12v and 18v tools and Dewalt is seriously behind on their battery capacities and technologies. 12v only gets 1.5ah batteries? cmon! No battery gauge? seriously? 20v batteries only recently got a bump in capacity and fuel gauges. I was also really dissapointed to find out that if I wanted to actually build a 20v max tool collection i was going to need to do it piece by piece rather than take advantage of the combo kit discounts. Why you ask? Because Dewalt thought it would be cute to cheapen the kit tools and hoped nobody would know. Im sure most dont even realize it but if you purchase a 20v kit with a Recipricating saw or circ saw you are NOT getting the same saw you would be getting if purchased seperately. That is honestly pathetic. With the recent announcment of who knows how many more brushless tools coming to Milwaukee if you are planning on buying into a new tool system TODAY its really difficult to look past Milwaukee. Heck, Milwaukees 12v line is reason enough to go with their 18v tools, thats how deep their 12v catalog is. You may not want or need a 12v tool now but if you ever did decide on one you arent getting much out of dewalt. In fact, Dewalts new Compact 18v drill is almost the same size as their 12v drill leaving me to wonder why I should even waste my time with Dewalts 12v line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Makita was also the first with the 18v lithium ion battery so everyone copied Makita, see what I mean... It's just how things work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 No I'd probably never need a 12v any why would I when the 20v lineup is barely bigger then the 12v...the 12v line I think see going to get more tools but more speciality tools like the scanner and other things... If your a tradesman and need a 12v drill go for it but I never seen any tradesman use one really. For someone who wants a huge 12v line, go Milwaukee... I just don't think the 12v line is as popular as some may think because the kits at local stores just don't move which maybe is why a lot of brands are dragging their feet with them.... Milwaukee is a good brand for a tool junkie to fill his needs for stuff but Dewalt seems to be the brand everyone chooses around here... The local guy building our new spca, his trailer is all yellow and he loves everything he uses from his 744 table saw to its 18v xrp drill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PedroHizzo Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I heard different things on uwo from Milwaukee guys saying Dewalt is hiding to actual math guys saying it's a more accurate way to measure a power tools total output power at the chuck so you guys can believe what you want it I'll still sleep tonight....The fact remains that the INDUSTRY does not use UWO as its respective measurement for torque so all dewalt is doing is confusing the consumer. Who cares if its more accurate, unless an independant lab is doing the measuring of ALL brand the numbers will always be skewed in favor of the respective brands claim. Plus when Dewalt was at the top where they still are Milwaukee copied Dewalt for years... Everyone does the same thing... If nobody copied anyone we'd have nothingI am fairly new here so maybe I am out of line but I'm going to ask you anyway. How much does DeWalt pay you to post on here? Because you sure do sound like one of their shills. And if you're not, you may want to rethink what you post on here because new guys like myself are just going to assume your some mouth jockey for DeWalt and disregard everything you say as nothing more than marketing bullshit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 Don't worry I'm not getting paid by Dewalt, but my comment I believe would be valid that Dewalt still holds most of the power tool market share in North America, would you not agree...some guys would think the exact same of the guys talking up Milwaukee... It's the same as ford and Chevy.... Guys bleed blue, some bleed bootie... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 If I was a dewalt shill, I wouldn't of said in my post if you want a huge 12v line go Milwaukee would I? Probably not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 The fact remains that the INDUSTRY does not use UWO as its respective measurement for torque so all dewalt is doing is confusing the consumer. Who cares if it's more accurate, unless an independant lab is doing the measuring of ALL brand the numbers will always be skewed in favor of the respective brands claim. I am fairly new here so maybe I am out of line but I'm going to ask you anyway. How much does DeWalt pay you to post on here? Because you sure do sound like one of their shills. And if you're not, you may want to rethink what you post on here because new guys like myself are just going to assume your some mouth jockey for DeWalt and disregard everything you say as nothing more than marketing bullshit.Three is no SAE or any kind of governing body that verifies and certifies anyone's measurements for their ft lbs in lbs whatn have you in power tools... For years in the auto industry it was a free for all in hp and to numbers until SAE began testing and certifying everything yo make sure nobody was fudging numbers... Might be time for power tool manufacturers to do the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PedroHizzo Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 Three is no SAE or any kind of governing body that verifies and certifies anyone's measurements for their ft lbs in lbs whatn have you in power tools... For years in the auto industry it was a free for all in hp and to numbers until SAE began testing and certifying everything yo make sure nobody was fudging numbers... Might be time for power tool manufacturers to do the same That would be bad news for DeWalt! Their cover might get blown not being able to hide behind UWO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PedroHizzo Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 Oh for those that actually care about the tool they are buying and not just the color of it, here is the link that shows you the differences between what DeWalt sells in their kits vs buying them seperately. this isnt the first time a manufacturer has dones this but its annoying and in a thread like this deserves to be pointed out: http://toolguyd.com/dewalt-20v-combo-kit-saw-differences/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banjerpicker Posted August 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 It's about 250 acres. My issue is, I have a 19.2 Craftsman drill driver that I've only used about a dozen times. The reason is, I am able to drill about 5 pilot holes and get the screws in before it goes dead. That is, providing, the battery doesnt go dead between uses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 That would be bad news for Dewalt Their cover might get blown not being able to hide behind UWO I think everyone might be a little hurt because I don't think all tools are totally accurate in the measurements they take... Like to become iso certified here et work years ago is a huge undertaking and process... And If let's say something like sae came in it would be a big change as well because none of the company's would agree to go it unless everyone does... They would all be worried but it would be good for the consumer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
07Sierra Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 Oh for those that actually care about the died they are buying anrecently just the color of it, here is the link that shows you the differences between what DeWalt sells in their kits vs buying them seperately. this isnt the first time a manufacturer has dones this but its annoying and in a thread like this deserves to be pointed out:http://toolguyd.com/dewalt-20v-combo-kit-saw-differences/The kit on the Dewalt website says the recip saw uses a multi position blade clamp... Unless they just added the good one ina recently Just checked and they Offer a cheaper kit and a premium kit... The cheaper kit would be a good for a diy homeowner who don't need the best of the best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PedroHizzo Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 The kit on the Dewalt website says the recip saw uses a multi position blade clamp... Unless they just added the good one ina recentlyJust checked and they Offer a cheaper kit and a premium kit... The cheaper kit would be a good for a diy homeowner who don't need the best of the best After all the shit they got from trying to hide what they did, they eventually came out with a revised kit and sold them side by side. It was never meant to be a Homeowner vs pro setup and for the first year the 20v max lineup was available you could only buy the kits with the cheapo tools at tjhe same price mind you as the new "pro" kit. In fact until recently I was still seeing some of the older kits at the big box stores. Hence why I brought it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conductor562 Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 There's truth in what Sierra07 is saying. Makita was the first to go brushless. They used Nimh batteries for years when Nicad was the standard. Dewalt was the market share leader for years and may still be. They had such a large market share that they dicked around long enough for Milwaukee to catch up after 2 ownership changes. TTI put the R&D and marketing dollars needed on the table to get Milwaukee back to what it once was. The reluctance of previous ownership to do this had a lot to do with Dewalt's market lead in the first place. Don't think marketing didn't play a big factor in Dewalt's lead, because it absolutely did.I agree with PedroHizzo. UWO's is Dewalt's way of pleading the 5th IMO. This thread (or any other) isn't going to change anyone's mind. People like what the like and they'll buy what they buy.If everyone quit buying things because of quality issue General Motors would've went bankrupt years ago......oh wait a second 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firefighter4187 Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 O7, Like pedro said, and is the reason I made the switch, where are all the specialty tools which in some trades are like a drill, they are the backbone? When is DeWalt planning on releasing them like 20v propex tools, force logic, caulking, multi tools??? These are all just as important in some trades, I feel bad for some of the trade guys using dewalt right now, I bet they are begging for these tools! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conductor562 Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 If I can find it, when I get home I'll post the OPT article that settles this dispute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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