12v max brushless!!

[Sam Steitz]

I already get great run time on my 12v tools but how awesome would it be to have a brushless 12v drill/driver? As long as you're not drilling holes with it all day the run time would be fantastic!

[Gatorb888]

Milwaukee already makes one: http://www.cpomilwaukee.com/milwaukee-2403-22-12v-cordless-lithium-ion-m12-fuel-1-2-in--drill-driver/miln2403-22,default,pd.html?ref=cj

 

Why would you spend $180 on a 12v drill when you could spend $40 more and get the DCD790D2 20 volt Brushless drill?

 

Dewalt: http://www.cpopowertools.com/dewalt-dcd790d2-20v-max-xr-cordless-lithium-ion-1-2-in--brushless-compact-drill-driver-kit/dewndcd790d2,default,pd.html

 

The Milwaukee 12v weighs 2.8 lbs and the Dewalt 20v weighs 3.5lbs ... You'd probably get 10 times more run time out of the 20v and be able to do much heavier applications. 

 

Also, the Milwaukee is 7.75" long, the Dewalt is only 7.2" long... 

[Javier]

He said 12v max. I believe he's talking about dewalt. He does bring up a good point, why don't they have 12v brushless yet, Bosch already does

It should be able to boost their 12v sales

[Gatorb888]

It doesn't make sense and I bet those companies are not selling as many 12v brushless as you think.

 

Take a look at the current Dewalt drill lineup:

12v Max Brushed - DCD710S2 - 2.4 lbs - 7.5" long - $139

20v Max Brushed - DCD780C2 - 3.4 lbs - 7.5" long - $199 (Currently on sale at most distributors for $179)

20v Max Brushless - DCD790D2 - 3.5 lbs - 7.2" long - $219 

 

 

Milwuakee M12 Brushless- 2403-22 - 2.8 lbs - 7.65" long - $179

Bosch 12v Max Brushless - PS32-02 - 2 lbs - 6.5" long - $159

 

The weight/length/price of 18/20v is down right around where brushless 12v is priced. Who would spend the same amount of money on a 12 drill when they could have a 20v drill that basically weighs the same. 

 

Even if you are a Milwaukee fan, the 2606-22CT M18 is normally priced at $199 ($179 I found on some retailers). That's the same price they are selling their 12v brushless for!

 

Brushed 18/20v will get you a lot more run time than a brushless 12v drill and a lot more power.

[Javier]

I have no clue how much brushless 12v stuff those companies are selling but you got to give them props for doing so. 

 

According to your comparison the bosch 12v brushless is the clear winner as it wins 2 out of 3, actually it wins 3 out of 3 in you factor in that you get brushless and 2.0 ah batteries for the extra $20 vs the dewalt 12v max

the problem with your comparison is that their all different class of drills, you got apples oranges and even some pears in the mix.

 

it seems to put the greatest emphasis on length and second weight but the problem with comparing lengths between 12v vs 18/20v is that 12v tools always seem to be much longer than 18/20v so the length is not proportional to power when comparing 12 vs 18/20v

 

it seems to be weight is proportional between 12 vs 18v

 

comparing the dewalt 12v max drill/driver to the milwaukee fuel m12 is like comparing a dcd780 to a dcd995, the dcd780 wins on paper in price weight length which are all the points youre making but then the dcd995 has brushless and is more powerful clearly they are not in the same class which I could say the same thing between the dewalt 12v and the milwaukee m12 fuel

 

I agree with you Gatorb888 about the 18/20v stuff will provide longer runtimes all day long but even you have agree that 12v is the way to go if you don't need the extra power and want something small and lightweight, its not like 12v has bad runtimes

 

you guys should give sam steitz what he wants, a dewalt 12v brushless drill, I think that would be awesome

[Gatorb888]

I understand what you are saying, and I think you understand what I was getting at. Truth is, it's up to product teams who have a lot more experience than myself and they decide what to release and what not too. They do a ton of research and I'm just assuming after all of that research they have decided that coming out with a $180 12v drill does not make much sense. Especially when you are selling an 18/20v drill for $20 more that only weighs 3.4 lbs. I'm not saying that it wouldn't be nice to have that tool in the lineup, or a cordless rivet gun, but it all comes down to how many will sell / if there is a big enough market for it. 

 

You're right on the value of the Bosch in the specs I provided. The Bosch has a 3/8" chuck and the Milwaukee has a 1/2" though.I would argue that having a 1/2" chuck on a 12v drill is overkill. Even a 1/2" bit is tapered down to fit a 3/8" chuck. I don't see too many situations where someone will be using a 12v drill to make holes larger than 1/2", if so they are using a spade bit. Milwaukee should have kept the 3/8" chuck and kept the price lower around where the Bosch is. 

[ChrisK]

I will say I owned the Milwaukee M12 Fuel drill guys. I sold it when I bought my T15. The 1/2" chuck on that 12v is awesome. All metal, not overkill. Tons of power and although it is a big 12 it is still smaller than the M18 and puts out high speed for drilling and boring as well as great torque for driving. Haven't tried the Bosch but +1 for the Fuel.

[Javier]

You're right on the value of the Bosch in the specs I provided. The Bosch has a 3/8" chuck and the Milwaukee has a 1/2" though.I would argue that having a 1/2" chuck on a 12v drill is overkill. Even a 1/2" bit is tapered down to fit a 3/8" chuck. I don't see too many situations where someone will be using a 12v drill to make holes larger than 1/2", if so they are using a spade bit. Milwaukee should have kept the 3/8" chuck and kept the price lower around where the Bosch is. 

I will agree that m12 fuel motor doesn't take full advantage of a 1/2 in chuck but its not overkill. It has an added advantage of being able to accept a wider assortment of accessories. I remember back in the day when all I had was a corded 3/8" b&d drill I wanted to get a mixing paddle for thinset, all the paddles I seen at the store were for 1/2" chucks so I had to settle with a 3/8" paint mixer attachment. Thats just a small example of the wider assortment of accessories that a 1/2" chuck can take advantage of, just look at the size of the 1" auger bit that Eric and Dan use in their videos, I wonder if the end that goes into the chuck would fit a 3/8" chuck.

 

Milwaukee could have kept 3/8 chuck but that wouldn't be milwaukee if they didn't push the envelope somehow. They could have kept the price low like the bosch but although you pay more you do get more, you get a 4.0 battery along with the 2.0. That alone makes up for the price difference but the value doesn't stop there, you get more power, premium features like a metal chuck, 1/2" chuck, mode selector collar, higher top speed. I can dig deeper but I think you get the point. That also brings up the point about apples and oranges, bosch and milwaukee clearly had a different goal when designing their 12v brushless drill. I wouldn't say the bosch sucks because its not as powerful, I think bosch did an excellent job with their drill its like a european sports car, lots of power in a small package. I would compare the milwaukee to an american muscle car, big, heavy with lots of muscle although for what the m12 fuel is its not heavy. If I needed a small lightweight drill I would pick the bosch anyday of the week.