Streamlining Battery Platforms

[fm2176]

If you were in a position to do so, would you reduce the number of battery platforms Stanley, Black & Decker (SBD) offers into a few compatible/interchangeable brands?  Their primary big box competitor here in the states, TTI, effectively offers three brands covering overlapping, yet distinct, tiers.  Milwaukee, Ridgid, and Ryobi offer just about any cordless tool or accessory needed with Ryobi mostly marketed as a value brand capable of most job, Milwaukee as a pro brand with an emphasis on trades, and Ridgid somewhere between the two but with an unmatched lifetime serivce agreement.  For the most part, TTI's brands don't directly compete with each other for display space or sales, and having four well-supported battery systems (I won't count Tek4 or Ridgid 12v as they seem all but dead in the water) with relatively minimal overlap seems like a good marketing marketing strategy for the corporation as a whole.

 

This leads me to SBD, which has a number of brands that seem to directly or indirectly compete with each other.  DeWalt is the "premium" brand, but what of Craftsman or Bostitch nail guns?  Where does Porter Cable fit into the equation, and are Black & Decker tools as good as Ryobi or just throwaway homeowner-grade junk?  With that said, each SBD brand has a legacy, strong brand recognition, and at least some amount of fan service.  As such, in my opinion they'd be best served by creating "universal" brand tiers that share common batteries while maintaining the brand themselves.  For those already invested in current battery systems, an adapter similar to the 20v Max to 18v DeWalt DCA1820 could be released.  My unsolicited thoughts are as follows:

 

DeWalt/Mac: Professional Use - keep the current 12v Max and 20v Max batteries, and continue marketing DeWalt as the premier "jack-of-all-trades" brand with Mac continuing its automotive focus.  Perhaps extend the awareness of Mac cordless tools by either a) selling them alongside DeWalt in stores, or b) making yellow versions of things like ratchets.  

 

Craftsman/Porter Cable/Bostitch: DIY/Light Professional Use - the former could be focused on automotive and basic carpentry tools (saws, drills, etc.) with Porter Cable focused on sanders and specialty tools (like the 20v Max tile saw) while Bostitch maintains its niche in the nailer market.

 

Black & Decker: Homeowner Use - keep the lower price point and expand the system as well as sales/special buy promos to better compete with Ryobi.  TTI has a "good, better, best" system with a lot of innovative tools such as pulse drivers (Ryobi Quietstrike, Ridgid Stealth, Milwaukee Surge) being separated by their size, weight, and power while maintaining a cross-platform sense of quality.  Black & Decker would benefit from seeing versions of tools currently offered in other SBD lineups and could also be used to test newer innovations without risking higher tiered brands' reputations.  In a pinch, bring FatMax cordless tools back to the states and make them a compatible but more premium version of the B&D lineup.

 

I'm picking on SBD because they are unique in my opinion.  Makita is, well, Makita, Bosch focuses on their namesake (though it might be nice if some Dremel tools were adapted to use Bosch 12v batteries), and Metabo HPT did away with their separate platforms a couple of years ago.  A trip to Lowe's for a new drill can find the uninitiated overwhelmed by the number of choices, half of which are SBD brands.  Metabo HPT, Bosch, Skil, and Kobalt take up a relatively small amount of space compared to DeWalt and Craftsman, while Porter Cable and B&D are a bit more subdued in their presence/marketing.  For those interested, Toolguyd has a comprehensive list of who owns what: https://toolguyd.com/tool-brands-corporate-affiliations/?utm_source=topmenu&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=buying-guides.

 

Anyway, what are your thoughts?  We've discussed universal battery systems before in the guise of cross-manufacturer systems, but the consensus is usually that this would not be financially beneficial to the corporations and would open the door to litigation (imagine being able to fit a Harbor Freight Warrior battery in an M18 Fuel OneKey tool, or a High Output battery in a DrillMaster).  Should SBD keep the status quo of pushing DeWalt and Craftsman to the forefront of sales, keeping B&D relegated to a small homeowner quality system, and letting Porter Cable, Bostitch, and other brands just kind of exist?  Should they emulate TTI and downsize to only three brands, or should they keep the brands but consolidate the number of battery systems, effectively creating "families" of brands with different end users in mind?  

[Jronman]

There is too much duplicate tools. I would say have 2 tiers (no middle tier). Each major category would have a homeowner and a pro brand associated with it and no more. The Homeowner focused tools would be compatible with each other and the pro focused tools would be compatible with each other. Basically Metabo's CAS but with SB&D products. SB&D and SB&D Pro could be a new sub-branding to indicate the CAS like functionality. SB&D would use B&D batteries and SB&D Pro would use DeWALT batteries (12v,20v,Flexvolt) Here are my pairs homeowner first and pro second.

1. General Power Tools: B&D and DeWALT
2. General Hand Tools: Stanley and Stanley Fatmax
3. OPE: B&D and Craftsman
4. Cordless Mechanics Tools: B&D and Mac
5. Portable Jobsite Storage: Stanley and Vidmar
6. Non Portable Storage: Stanley and Lista
7. Consumables(Blades, Bits, Sandpaper,etc.): Irwin and Lenox
8. Mechanics Hand Tools: Blackhawk and Proto
9. Customized Tools (basically the SB&D equivalent of what Tanos does): Stanley and Facom
10. Pneumatic and Fasteners(Air/Battery nailers,staplers,riveters) B&D and Bostitch
11. Specialty Woodworking: B&D and Porter Cable

[fm2176]

7 hours ago, Jronman said:

There is too much duplicate tools. I would say have 2 tiers (no middle tier). Each major category would have a homeowner and a pro brand associated with it and no more. The Homeowner focused tools would be compatible with each other and the pro focused tools would be compatible with each other. Basically Metabo's CAS but with SB&D products. SB&D and SB&D Pro could be a new sub-branding to indicate the CAS like functionality. SB&D would use B&D batteries and SB&D Pro would use DeWALT batteries (12v,20v,Flexvolt) Here are my pairs homeowner first and pro second.

1. General Power Tools: B&D and DeWALT
2. General Hand Tools: Stanley and Stanley Fatmax
3. OPE: B&D and Craftsman
4. Cordless Mechanics Tools: B&D and Mac
5. Portable Jobsite Storage: Stanley and Vidmar
6. Non Portable Storage: Stanley and Lista
7. Consumables(Blades, Bits, Sandpaper,etc.): Irwin and Lenox
8. Mechanics Hand Tools: Blackhawk and Proto
9. Customized Tools (basically the SB&D equivalent of what Tanos does): Stanley and Facom
10. Pneumatic and Fasteners(Air/Battery nailers,staplers,riveters) B&D and Bostitch
11. Specialty Woodworking: B&D and Porter Cable

 

I like your train of thought, however, I'd say that Craftsman and Mac are both essential brands for SBD when it comes to mechanics tools.  Since I worked in a dealership over twenty years ago a lot of things have changed, but I still see tool trucks rather often and I know that their business model of extending truck credit is a convenient--if slightly predatory--way of helping mechanics and technicians do their job.  By predatory, I don't mean with high interest, but rather the relatively high prices of the tools themselves.  I sometimes find tools I bought off the Snap-On, Mac, or Matco truck back in the day that I paid a premium for (especially some of the Lisle specialty tools that see a significant markup on the truck).

 

If Lowe's got fully on board with Craftsman and started offering separate had tools, both companies could see a lot of success.  Basically, do with Craftsman what they did with Kobalt when they launched in 1998: offer quality USA-made tools that are an alternative to both the truck brands and the Home Depot / Harbor Freight brands.  I worked at the Cadillac dealership down the street from a Lowe's when Kobalt launched and though I never bought into the brand at the time I thought it was interesting that an alternative to Sears had popped up.  Now, having owned some Williams-made Kobalt tools, I wish I'd have paid more attention back then.

[fm2176]

Watching a hammer drill test video on YouTube just now, I was reminded that TTI does have some brand redundancy of sorts.  This is yet another video where Hart and Ryobi are compared (along with other brands), and I note that the two are often similar in test results.  In this case, an $80 Hart kit including a 1.5Ah battery is tested against a $158 Ryobi kit with 4.0Ah battery as well as an off-brand, M18 Fuel, FlexVolt Advantage, and Makita drills.  

 

While Hart and Ryobi seem to be peers, albeit with the latter offering more premium kits and a lot more tools, I'd say that TTI still gets this relationship right.  Namely, Ryobi is well known as a Home Depot house brand, while Hart started dominating Walmart a year or two ago.  The two stores are not direct competitors and their customer bases are a bit different, so Hart and Ryobi aren't necessarily in direct competition.  Contrast this to SBD and their presence in Lowe's, where Porter Cable continues to be sold alongside Craftsman despite the latter seeming to have taken its place in the hierarchy.  For better or worse, Walmart doesn't have a whole lot of brick and mortar competition these days, with Kmart being almost dead and Target targeting a slightly different demographic, but imagine if Porter Cable could enter into an agreement with Target.  Admittedly, Target has very little focus on tools and home improvement, with my local stores relegated to a few basic hand tool kits and one aisle of basic hardware/home improvement goods.

[Eric - TIA]

Great thread. For SBD is a mess, just too much going on.  I agree with TTI and their set up with Milwaukee, Ridgid and Ryobi.  In my head, i have no idea what SBD is trying to do right now with all these brands.  For a while they were going to bring back Porter Cable and make that compete with Ryobi.  As of today, the brand looks dead.  I saw a huge push with Craftsman, then the push was gone.  Sure it's in Lowes, but I don't ever hear anything about them.  Is Craftsman going the way of Porter Cable?  Why would I invest in Craftsman power tools right now?  Heck even the same with Black & Decker tools.  Yes, I see them all at the store and yes, by each other but just unsure of the future.  

 

So to answer your question, I think a universal battery platform would be a great idea.  Right now I wouldn't invest in any of these brands because I am not sure which one will be around tomorrow.  If I know that the batteries are common, I would be more willing to invest in a brand because it if wasn't supported or wasn't coming out with new tools, I can just buy into one of the other brands on this platform.

[ToolBane]

Craftsman to me makes sense against Ridgid and Kobalt. It would compete as well against Ryobi on account of the fact that Ryobi lately has been inching up into prosumer territory, but I don’t personally think they should be a bottom-of-the-barrel DIY company. They’ve already shoved Black and Decker into that niche and it hasn’t really gone well for them.

 

Porter Cable just seems lost in the mix. Maybe it could be licensed as an exclusive line for a home improvement chain in a similar manner as Ridgid is for Home Depot, but along the way I agree with the sentiment that a unified battery platform shared with Craftsman makes a lot of sense. Have more product overlap to reduce development costs, and also have some versatility for consumers to have slightly varied tiers of tools without having to fully buy into entire additional platforms.

 

Ultimately I don’t think it matters exactly where they decide to divvy up all their different brands across the market, they just need some concrete plan to commit to and stick with it.

[fm2176]

On 1/25/2021 at 11:15 AM, Eric - TIA said:

  So to answer your question, I think a universal battery platform would be a great idea.  Right now I wouldn't invest in any of these brands because I am not sure which one will be around tomorrow.  If I know that the batteries are common, I would be more willing to invest in a brand because it if wasn't supported or wasn't coming out with new tools, I can just buy into one of the other brands on this platform.

 

44 minutes ago, ToolBane said:

Porter Cable just seems lost in the mix. Maybe it could be licensed as an exclusive line for a home improvement chain in a similar manner as Ridgid is for Home Depot, but along the way I agree with the sentiment that a unified battery platform shared with Craftsman makes a lot of sense. Have more product overlap to reduce development costs, and also have some versatility for consumers to have slightly varied tiers of tools without having to fully buy into entire additional platforms.

 

Ultimately I don’t think it matters exactly where they decide to divvy up all their different brands across the market, they just need some concrete plan to commit to and stick with it.

 

SBD's brands seem to have more detractors than other corporations' due in large part to the number of battery platforms they've had over the years.  I didn't stay up to date with tool news when Milwaukee discontinued the V18 line some twelve years ago, and while the change to M18 caused a few to switch brands, you don't commonly hear people bring up Milwaukee (or other TTI brands) when they complain about batteries and tool system longevity.  Over the past few years, I've heard and/or thought the following gripes and opinions about SBD cordless tools (some of which isn't necessarily their fault):

 

DeWalt: 20v Max "false advertising"; 18v Li-Ion batteries discontinued; 18v line incompatible with 20v Max; 12v Max "dead" (before the XTREME tools were released); 12v Max not competitive with M12

 

Craftsman: not compatible with Sears Craftsman systems; overall confusion with Sears Craftsman; distrust due to Sears' abandonment of previous Craftsman systems

 

Porter Cable: changeover from 18v to 20v Max; lack of growth in the system compared to competitors (namely Ryobi); future of the system (especially since the acquisition of Craftsman)

 

Bostitch: 20v Max: "So, I'm buying this battery system that only supports a few nail guns?"; 18v: Wow! Walmart carries Bostitch power tools, these must be almost as good as DeWalt!  Wait, where'd they go?"  (Coincidentally while writing this, I found that my local store has a drill/impact combo for $30.  Went to the store and searched to no avail, if it still shows one in stock I may ask about it the next time I go.  Not getting my hopes up since this system hasn't been sold for a while)

 

Fatmax: Walmart sold them, then Bostitch replaced them.

 

Black & Decker: "why doesn't this B&D battery marked 20v Max fit my twenty year old drill?"

[Eric - TIA]

It's an amazing web of lines they have all twisted to make it more compilated over the years.

[fm2176]

On 1/27/2021 at 9:02 AM, Eric - TIA said:

It's an amazing web of lines they have all twisted to make it more compilated over the years.

 

You summarized my post very succinctly.  I tend to get wordy, especially when I'm killing time...

 

 

[Jronman]

DeWALT is even getting redundant in ways: 20v max, power detect, flexvolt advantage, flexvolt. I see B&D as the intended equal to Ryobi even though the products are at a much lower quality to that of Ryobi. I still feel Craftsman does not need to have mechanics handtools. SB&D already has Blackhawk to fill the space for entry level mechanics hand tools. Many people know Craftsman for their mechanics tools and tool chests but its the only brand the SB&D owns other than B&D that is known for the ope. SB&D owns many brands known for mechanics tools and storage so to have those product lines under the Craftsman name would continue the redundancy trend.

[Saddlestretcher]

On 1/25/2021 at 11:15 AM, Eric - TIA said:

Great thread. For SBD is a mess, just too much going on.  I agree with TTI and their set up with Milwaukee, Ridgid and Ryobi.  In my head, i have no idea what SBD is trying to do right now with all these brands.  For a while they were going to bring back Porter Cable and make that compete with Ryobi.  As of today, the brand looks dead.  I saw a huge push with Craftsman, then the push was gone.  Sure it's in Lowes, but I don't ever hear anything about them.  Is Craftsman going the way of Porter Cable?  Why would I invest in Craftsman power tools right now?  Heck even the same with Black & Decker tools.  Yes, I see them all at the store and yes, by each other but just unsure of the future.  

 

So to answer your question, I think a universal battery platform would be a great idea.  Right now I wouldn't invest in any of these brands because I am not sure which one will be around tomorrow.  If I know that the batteries are common, I would be more willing to invest in a brand because it if wasn't supported or wasn't coming out with new tools, I can just buy into one of the other brands on this platform.

This was exactly why I posted about the battery topic.  It seems like I need to pick a platform before the tools. 

[Eric - TIA]

On 1/31/2021 at 8:32 AM, fm2176 said:

 

You summarized my post very succinctly.  I tend to get wordy, especially when I'm killing time...

 

 

succinctly - Word of the day.  I had to look that up, I like it.  Now I have to figure a way to include that in my vocabulary today.